Fire Engines Photos

What a lovely looking, well preserved 1954 Thornycroft water tender.One always
thinks of Thornycroft and their airfield crash tenders, I must say though this photograph well deserves to be on the site for all of us to see.Thanks.

Added by Pete Matten on 29 April 2008.

Unfortunately, Pete, this appliance is rotten and decayed inside. I believe it is an on-going project! Also, since the arrival of three New Dimensions Prime Movers at Rugeley, this beauty no longer has a Garage, so I'm wondering how the cruel British weather will affect her.

Cheers,
Yelp Bullhorn

Added by Yelp Bullhorn on 04 May 2008.

Yelp Bullhorn, this photo has captured my imagination, do you have any more of her, looks like something from 'Thomas The Tank Engine & Friends' beautiful, , , ,

Added by Pavel on 05 May 2008.

Sorry Pavel, but I haven't. She really is something though, isn't she?

Added by Yelp Bullhorn on 06 May 2008.

Great shot of a rugged fire-engine it is really impressive.
Hope she gets under shelter, and gets her needed TLC.
Regards,
Pat_R-B
PS "Tender Loving Care"

Added by Pat_R-B on 21 June 2008.

She is under shelter now and undergoing further renovation, but we fear we may have significant engine problems: if anyone knows where to source a sound Rolls Royce B80 (the 8 cylinder wet sump petrol engine)we'd very much like to hear from them. It may be more pratcical to replace the engine than rebuild the present unit.

Added by Ian McBride on 23 March 2009.

Cheshire had some similar machines but were Type A WrTs rather than Type Bs. I did hear a rumour that Northwiche's had survived albeit converted to an ACT. Anyone any ideas??

Added by Neal Glover on 01 July 2010.

Northampton had an identical appliance, too. No idea what happened to it. I always admired the unique effort to avoid positioning the bells on the roof, but never understood why it mattered.

Added by Rob Johnson on 28 February 2012.

Probably to keep the height down. I think Cheshire's had their ladders further back ie lower.

Added by Neal Glover on 01 March 2012.

The Cheshire ones did have the ladder further back, the head of the ladder was just over the FIRE sign. I remember Frodsham and Northwich having these appliances.

Added by Dave Price on 02 March 2012.

I remember Northwich's in the garage at the back of the station before it went on the run. It seemed huge but then I was only about 7, my father was in the AFS at Northwich initially with a wartime HU. The Thorneycroft replaced a Austin K3/4 MDU/WrT , like the one in the 1st edition MoF. Part 2

Added by Neal Glover on 02 March 2012.

As a child about 40 odd yrs ago I saw one of these at Stone Fire Station (Staffs) from memory they also had an ERF as the first away , your right it did look big even against the ERF , my Dads mate showed us around who was a leading fireman there .

Added by Gary Bolton on 03 March 2012.

Just an update. She is still needing a new engine/rebuild. Anybody anywhere know of a rolls royce b80 engine or anybody who is familiar with them?

Added by Peter on 06 August 2012.

Interesting. I own Nubian XRE991, unfortunately it's in a terrible state and awaiting a lottery win. It was on the Carmichael stand at the Earl's Court motor show in 1951 and then was delivered new to Leek at a cost of £4, 800 (in 1951 remember!). It then moved to Cheadle. My father drove identical Nubian, 784GRE, at Cheadle in the 50s and I remember not being as tall as the tyres on it! A number of these Nubians (4x4s of course)were stationed within easy access of Cannock chase and the Staffordshire Moorlands to combat heath and woodland fires.

Added by Andrew Wardle on 28 May 2014.

4X4 water tenders were - and still are - a bit of a rarity in the UK, but they do reduce the need to have separate specialized off-road fire tenders. The big exception was the AFS switch to 4X4 R series Bedfords after large numbers of rear wheel drive S series had already been placed into service, although I don't know what percentage of the total fleet they were.

In France - which has large areas of inaccessible forests and brush - the numbers of 4X4 off-road rural pump tankers actually exceed structural fire pumpers, with many stations having one of each.

In Germany, despite being the country where the amazing Unimog was invented, most small towns (and many large cities) operate mainly or entireky 4X4 pump and water tender fleets - often backed up by a Unimog and a 4X4 5, 000 liter tanker.

Rather surprisingly, Scandinavian fire services do not seem to favor 4X4, despite the fact that they often have to negotiate snow-covered roads, nor are they very common in chilly Poland - but they are often seen in Russia and the former Soviet Union countries, including 6X6 pumpers and even turntable ladders!

Added by Rob Johnson on 30 May 2014.

Rob I think you will find very few of the Bedford 4x4 were issued to the AFS. In this area of the Northwest I know of only one and that was in Liverpool for some reason, They had no need for off road in the city.They has SYH 185.

Added by Dave Price on 06 June 2014.

Dave, I think you may be right. I remember an AFS excercise in Darlington where they brought ten pumpers and Several other units together, including a 6" pipeline layer. None of the Green Goddesses was a 4X4. But I am sure someone out there has the actual Home Office statistics, and may share them with us.

As I mentioned, very few county brigades in the UK operate or have operated 4X4 water tenders, nor indeed are there very many 4X4 rural pumpers (except Land Rovers) in use.

Added by Rob Johnson on 06 June 2014.

Dave - I have come across an article which says that there were 1300 2X4 AFS Bedfords and 1800 4X4s, all of which were built later. Apparently over 1, 000 of these were placed in to storage and not assigned to fire stations, so this may be why the 4X4 were a less common sight.

Added by Rob Johnson on 06 June 2014.

And the AFS machines were Pumps not Water Tenders !

Added by Barrie Green on 06 June 2014.

I remember being told Wallasey had a 4x4 and today was told Oldham had one. The idea of swapping to the 4x4 for the AFS was for driving over rubble etc in the event of major destruction following a nuclear attack.

Added by on 07 June 2014.

Barrie - the S series AFS units had 400 IG tanks and the R series 4X4 had 300 IG tanks. So these earlier ones were technically water tenders and the later 4X4s were not. I am not sure it matters much, nor is it clear to me why the Home Office reduced the tank size on the 4X4s.

Added by Rob Johnson on 11 June 2014.

Just to throw my hat into the ring! the Home Office designation for the Green Goddess' is Emergency Pump! Regardless if it was on a Bedford SHZ 4X2 OR Bedford RLHZ 4x4 chassis. And as the 4x4's are higher and the Tanks aren't fitted with baffles the reduction in capacity is proberly to do with stabilaty.They roll when cornering!

Added by Chris Stone on 12 June 2014.

The tank was the same but modified due to it being to heavy with 400 gals. Can find no record of eather Oldham or Wallesy having a 4x4 but Rochdale had one.

Added by Dave Price on 13 June 2014.

Rob. I think it was because of the higher C of G of the 4x4s. They can be a bit unstable with 300galls so with 400it does not bare thinking about. Keeping the tyre pressures up seems to be the key to an upright experience. Certainly the low tyre pressures got most of the blame for the fatal roll over during the 1976 strike.

Added by Neal Glover on 13 June 2014.

Having owned a 4x2 and a 4x4, tyres do make a difference.the height of the sidewall on a single tyre is the main and flexes under load.also the position of the water tank.the 400gal is right at the bank , the 300gal is right behind the cab.i belive this was done to achive a 50/50 weight balance as the 4x2 was tail heavy.BOTH will roll.my 4x2 was NYV168 and I currently have PGW340.

Added by Tim Webster on 22 June 2014.

The comments on the Bedfords having stability problems are interesting. My Nubian (XRE991) had its own moment when it rolled over on the way down Church Bank in Oakamoor, (Near Cheadle in Staffordshire). The height of the water tank and its lack of baffles were later given as the cause. It ended up facing back up the hill, embedded in the stone wall opposite the church gates. Once righted it was driven back to the station at Cheadle and went off for quite minor repairs. The nearside front corner of the roof had been peeled back and there were various scratches but very little other damage. A friend, Clive Stonier was in the crew that day and remembers it well. He and a colleague got a lift back to Cheadle and went out on another call, on another engine, within minutes of arriving. These days they'd need a month's trauma counselling !

Added by Andrew Wardle on 24 June 2014.

Interesting that when I was a student at Cambridge in 1964 the county brigade had several water tenders on RL chassis with 400 gallon tanks, as well as a unique RL ET and an RL water tanker with a 1000 gallon tank! I hope their drivers (who included quite a few retained personnel) knew what they were doing driving these 4X4s "on the bell".

I have noticed that Ziegler and some other German fire engine bodybuilders move the tank forwards to the midships position on the 4X4 versions of the MAN and Atego chassis, although the tank size is not reduced in size.

Here in the US, rural fire departments often rely on tanker shuttles, using many 6X4 maximum GVW tankers with 12000 liter tanks. Unfortunately these do experience a horrific number of accidents, including frequent rollovers - because they are just not stable enough to be driven fast on winding country roads. There are many photos of these kind of tankers on this site.

Added by Rob Johnson on 24 June 2014.

Is there an update on this appliance? I understand it was one involved in the 1976 forest fire in and around Kinver/Drakelow in Worcestershire. Is it still located at Rugeley fire station?

Added by Michael Scott on 14 February 2015.

329 BRF moved to a museum in Wales before finding a home at the Museum of RAF Firefighting at RAF Scampton but as stated above although looking fantastic it has severe rot on the nearside rear cab locker area and believe is still after a replacement engine and as the museum is concentrating on its own collection funds are presently not available for loan vehicles.

Added by Brett Clayton on 21 February 2015.

Thanks for the update.

Added by Michael Scott on 24 February 2015.

Birkenhead Borough had 2 AFS appliances a 4x2 and a 4x4. Both of which they turned over when "borrowing" them when one of their red Bedford's was off the run.

Added by John Bratley on 23 September 2016.

Did anyone know Peter Brass, who served in the AFS at Rugeley Staffs from 1965 until 1968?

If anyone also has any documents or photographs of the AFS appliance which was stationed at Rugeley at the time also, please contact me re:- my e mail address please?

Added by David Hill (1412) on 04 January 2017.

This fine old beauty is now being stored in Uttoxeter's spare appliance bay, minus the two front-mounted bells.

Added by Yelp Bullhorn on 14 August 2017.

Nubian (XRE991) is now sadly too far gone for restoration. I've been hanging on to it because I just can't bring myself to ring the scrapman! I saw a note on the Staffs Fire & Rescue website about the identical ex-Rugeley one being donated and I'm wondering if they'd like to scavenge mine for spares before the inevitable happens? The engine is shot but the transmission is quite sought after. Does anyone have a contact name and number for whom so ever is in charge of it ?

Added by Andrew Wardle. on 16 August 2017.

I am sure spares would be appreciated although the main requirement is a new engine, I suspect. (I am one of the 3 donors of the Rugeley m/c back to Staffs F&B). The brigade is hoping to get it running, according to a press release they issued.

Added by Peter Harkness on 16 August 2017.

329 BRF is still parked inside Uttoxeter Fire Station with tape round it and 'do not touch' notices attached. The two bells are not on the machine. I walk past the station most days and quite often stop and look in to make sure that it is still there!

Added by Donald Handley on 18 September 2020.

XRE991 is here



Added by Petros on 03 January 2024.

329BRF to be restored according to this

www.search.staffspasttrack.org.uk/Details.aspx?&ResourceID=48593&PageIndex=12&SearchType=2&ThemeID=15

Added by Petros on 08 March 2024.

329 BRF has gone from Uttoxeter fire station, or at least it is not 'in the window'. It's place has been taken by a second Scania appliance.

Added by Donald Handley on 27 May 2024.

Is it at Stone ha ?

Added by Phillip jordan on 25 May 2026.

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