Fire Engines Photos

Peterborough Volunteer fire brigade bought this appliance themselves new. We still have it on station for fundraising ect. Lovley photo.

Added by Willbaker on 23 December 2009.

How is it that there is only one volunteer fire brigade in the UK? Most other countries have huge numbers of volunteers.

Added by Rob Johnson on 05 March 2013.

We do have (in effect) a large number of volunteer firefighters in the UK Rob, the only real difference is that we pay them for the time and commitment that they give to the service. This also ensures that these retained firefighters are subject to the same qualifications, training, discipline regulations etc. as their wholetime colleagues. Perhaps more importantly, this also means that they are eligible for the same medical benefits, firefighter's charity services and (in recent years) pension scheme.

Added by Mel Turbutt on 06 March 2013.

Rob, there is, or at least was a volunteer station in Devon. The name escapes me but I visited it whilst on my hols down there around six years ago. Lovely little station in a lovely village.

Added by Matt Ireland on 06 March 2013.

Here in the US we also have paid on-call firefighters in many communities, but these are to be distinguished from volunteers, as our volunteers get no compensation.

The system of insurance, benefits and compensation for injuries varies from state to state, but the vast majority of our firefighters in the US are still all volunteers.

I used to live in Nassau county on Long Island, which borders two of the boroughs of New York City. Our very urban county, with 1.4 million population, was protected exclusively by volunteers operating fire and EMS out of 190 stations. Most of the staff positions were of course full-time, and the busier stations often had a full-time driver on the day watch for the first due unit, but everyone else was a volunteer.

All had to pass state-approved training courses and periodic testing, and everyone in my local department had to attend 25% of all runs - otherwise they were out. Because membership was a very prestigious matter, this was a shameful outcome to be avoided at all costs!

The equation was that if there was no payroll expense for operating personnel, a much higher level of fire cover could be afforded. This meant more funds to be devoted to building and operating a larger number of stations, more and better apparatus and equipment, including special-purpose units- and much more extensive training for the members.

Because of the 25% rule, these volunteers actually attended just about as many runs as their full-time colleagues would have done, operating a three or four watch system, minus leave days.

Added by Rob Johnson on 06 March 2013.

There is also a volunteer station at Borth on the Welsh coast.

Added by Mel Turbutt on 06 March 2013.

Rob, I think that the answer is that both of our countries have evolved fire services that suit our various social and economical needs. I can see advantages and disadvantages to both systems, but that doesn't mean that what works for one country would necassarily work for the other. Maybe the fact that our standard of living in the UK is such that many people could not afford to give such a commitment without some form of reimbursement? I know from experience that we often struggle to maintain retained crewing levels in certain areas even with the added incentive of a salary. Our respective approaches are different, even if our goals (public safety) are the same.

Added by Mel Turbutt on 07 March 2013.

Many countries in south America and central Europe rely heavily on volunteers, and they tend to have much lower living standards than in the UK, so I am not sure it boils down to a question of money.

Being a firefighter is a high prestige job in many places, and large numbers of people aspire to volunteer membership, even without any payment.

In several countries, volunteers provide a valuable back-up for full-time firefighters, even in major cities. Berlin, for example, has 35 full-time fire stations, backed up by no less than 56 volunteer stations. Some of these do provide joint first-response in outlying areas, but most function to respond on second or higher alarms and/or to occupy vacated full-time stations on standby.

They are typically equipped with standard pumpers, tankers, aerial ladders and hose layers, as well as the newer-specification HLF rescue pumpers. Some of their trucks (mostly MAN and Mercedes) are pretty old, but they are very well maintained and fully serviceable.

I also discovered that Scotland has quite a few volunteer stations in addition to full-time, retained and part-manned stations. These are in the remote highlands and islands - which are probably the least affluent communities in that country!

It seems to be a cultural issue:- if you don't volunteer, your community is at risk, but if you do, you will gain the respect, admiration and gratitude of your friends and neighbors, plus a few free beers from time to time!

Added by Rob Johnson on 07 March 2013.

You are of course entitled to your view Rob, but please don't infer that the retained firefighters in the UK are any less committed to their communities. I never served as a retained firefighter, but my late father did for 20 years and shortly before I retired, I attended a fire in which 4 retained firefighters lost their lives. They may have been paid for doing what they did, but this doesn't mean that they had any less commitment.

Added by Mel Turbutt on 07 March 2013.

Not just Borth, Caldy Island off Tenby is also Volunteer.

Added by D.K on 08 March 2013.

North Yorkshire had at least two Volunteer stations. One being Gothland. The village was used for the TV program Heart Beat.Grassington was one but was upgraded to retained. I had a photo of the station at gothland I will try and find and post it.

Added by Dave Price on 08 March 2013.

Mel - no such thoughts, I assure you. If the only opportunity to serve in a person's home community is as a paid on-call firefighter, then that's how everyone has to do it!

My point was more that in some countries there are actually waiting lists for people who want to volunteer, even though the training courses are very time-consuming and there is no financial compensation for time lost from their regular job.

I also think that many countries probably obtain better fire cover by utilizing volunteer resources, either as first responders or in a reserve role.

For example, I grew up in Darlington and went to college in Cambridge, both of which had a single full-time station with three pumps, a rescue truck and a TL. Heidelberg, where I also lived for a while, was a slightly larger city; it also had one full-time station, with two pumps, a rescue truck and a TL. But the full-timers were backed up by eight volunteer stations with another twelve pumps!

Added by Rob Johnson on 08 March 2013.

Up here in Tayside we have 3 volunteer stations, 32 Kinnloch Rannoch V reg Scania, 33 Kirkmachael V reg Scania and 34 Glenshee S582PSR Volvo the last serving Volvo in frontline service.

Added by Grant Melville on 08 March 2013.

what about Geddington VFB near Kettering, Northamptonshire. Their wonderful appliance can be seen at picture 27028.

Added by Peter Williams on 10 March 2013.

Peter....I don't think Geddington can be classed as a 'serious' fire brigade, from what I read, it's more like a gentle men's club. Big apologies if I am wrong !

Added by Barrie Green on 10 March 2013.

Quite a few volunteer outfits in both the US and Germany have "social" members - their main role is to help with fundraising - in addition to active members who actually respond to calls and participate in all the training and qualification testing.

I have discovered that the expression " gentlemens'club" has an unfortunately prurient undertone in the US - hope this is not the case in English English!

Added by Rob Johnson on 10 March 2013.

The Geddington Brigade was formed for practical purposes during the 1977 fire men's strike but since then, it's a charitable men's club to concentrate on doing good works round the village, decorating for old people, keeping the streets clean etc.....the nearest it's been used for emergency works is when the river flooded by all accounts. It would seem that most of the male population of the village are members!

Added by Barrie Green on 10 March 2013.

Interesting anecdote: Peterborough Volunteer Fire Brigade is actually the oldest fire brigade on the planet.

Added by Yelp Bullhorn on 14 March 2013.

Yelp - older than the Vigili del Fueco in Rome, which is more than 1, 600 years old?

Added by Rob Johnson on 25 March 2013.

There are four mainland English Volunteer fire stations, Peterborough, Kingston, Goathland, Lofthouse.there is a volunteer station on LUNDY Island but this is only for the island, Borth Wales and the large number in Scotland

Added by Pete Ashpool on 06 September 2013.

Just another illustration of the huge difference between UK practice and Germany. The town of Celle, with 72000 population and 450 incidents a year has an all-volunteer fire service with nine stations staffed by over 400 volunteers.

They operate 11 pumps, 4 aerial ladders, three command cars and numerous special-purpose units including rescue, hazmat, hose, logistics, brush fire trucks and others. They do not provide ambulance or EMS services.

Added by Rob Johnson on 07 September 2013.

Just to add another snippet to this discussion, I recently learned that Chile, with a population over 17 million and several major cities operates exclusively with unpaid volunteer firefighters. This includes Santiago, the capital, with more than 5 million citizens.

As a result of having a service with no payroll expenses, they have around 250 operational firefighters per 100, 000 population - around 3.4 times as many as in the UK!

Another interesting fact is that close to 20% of the operational firefighters are females.

They do employ paid civilian support staff, and emergency calls and dispatch are handled by the police, who also dispatch ambulances.

Added by Rob Johnson on 03 December 2017.

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